The RAMS Forum

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zackn wrote: ↑March 2nd, 2021, 8:04 am

Ncromwell21 wrote: ↑March 2nd, 2021, 7:37 am that he never won a playoff game is a result of never having a shut down defense or a running game to eat clock at end of game.

Can't overgeneralize. In 2014 they had a defense ranked 2nd in yards and 3rd in points. That's a shut down defense. They went 11-5 that year, their best year with Stafford. It's true they did not have a running game.

That is true but that was the year that every play the Lions ran that was effective at end of game they got a holding call and the picked up PI call that was clearly PI. One of the worst officiated games ever.

Commish wrote: ↑February 28th, 2021, 8:48 pm

Truth wrote: ↑February 28th, 2021, 4:06 am
From 1985 onward, of guys Rams had in their prime:

3 Stafford
8. Banks

I didn't have a high opinion of Tony Banks, yet I'll take his Rams QB stats over Matthew Stafford's any time... ;) :?

ram pathos...

--The Commish

Tony Banks was garbage. In one year Stafford will make you forget all about all those other duds the Rams had at QB. Even Everett and Bulger. Both had some decent seasons, but neither was a winner. I think we are going to find out real quick what kind of QB Stafford is. Unlike Goff, if we are down in the 4th we still have a chance. I had zero confidence in Goff ever bringing us back when we were down late. He always choked.

NN1Badboy wrote: ↑March 2nd, 2021, 4:06 pm
I think we are going to find out real quick what kind of QB Stafford is.

Since I've been a Rams fan, I've been exposed to a whole lot of glowing positive predictions about highly-touted QBs right after our team has acquired them, whether via the draft, a trade or even a free-agency signing.

These include John Hadl, Pat Haden, Joe Namath, Bert Jones, Jim Everett, Trent Green, Sam Bradford, Nick Foles and Jared Goff.

Haden, Everett and Goff were the only ones to enjoy even two solid (or better) seasons starting at QB for the Good Guys, despite the fans' enthusiasm for all of them.

So I'll be patiently waiting until September to view how Matthew Stafford actually performs for the Rams... ;) :?

ram pathos...

--The Commish

Ncromwell21 wrote: ↑March 2nd, 2021, 2:32 pm

zackn wrote: ↑March 2nd, 2021, 8:04 am Can't overgeneralize. In 2014 they had a defense ranked 2nd in yards and 3rd in points. That's a shut down defense. They went 11-5 that year, their best year with Stafford. It's true they did not have a running game.

That is true but that was the year that every play the Lions ran that was effective at end of game they got a holding call and the picked up PI call that was clearly PI. One of the worst officiated games ever.

Every play hunh. In 2014 the Lions were 16th in offensive holding and on PI, were tied for 27th with 9 for the season. https://www.footballdb.com/stats/penalt ... 4&sort=dpi

They weren't league leaders in avoiding those things but it wasn't quite so bad in terms of the holding.

You may be talking about just one game, the playoff game. In that they were penalized on PI twice in the end of the 4th quarter. They ended on offense down by 4 with 2:32 to go but had a false start and then a sack. There was one holding call on the Lions; it was in the 2nd quarter.

Commish wrote: ↑February 28th, 2021, 8:48 pm

Truth wrote: ↑February 28th, 2021, 4:06 am
From 1985 onward, of guys Rams had in their prime:

3 Stafford
8. Banks

I didn't have a high opinion of Tony Banks, yet I'll take his Rams QB stats over Matthew Stafford's any time... ;) :?

ram pathos...

--The Commish

Seriously? Tony Banks was awful. If Stafford plays as bad as Banks, then everyone in the organization should be fired.

Truth wrote: ↑March 2nd, 2021, 8:16 pm

Commish wrote: ↑February 28th, 2021, 8:48 pm I didn't have a high opinion of Tony Banks, yet I'll take his Rams QB stats over Matthew Stafford's any time... ;) :?

ram pathos...

Seriously? Tony Banks was awful. If Stafford plays as bad as Banks, then everyone in the organization should be fired.

My point was that Matthew Stafford has *zero* stats as a Rams QB right now, so of course Tony Banks currently has better stats with our team--so do Austin Davis and T.J. Rubley, even Johnny Hekker has more pass completions for the Good Guys than Stafford.

In other words, at this moment Stafford has no business being compared to other Rams QBs on any list, doing so with him is pure projection... ;) :?

ram pathos...

--The Commish

SoCalRam78 wrote: ↑March 2nd, 2021, 8:12 pm
Rams franchise has never had a real franchise QB. Why they’ve been second rate. I agree with the OP. Warner was elite but his success was relatively short lived with the Rams.

Ummmm, what about Bob Waterfield and Norm van Brocklin?

There's no doubt in my mind that they both were franchise QBs for our team.

Roman Gabriel's somewhat borderline, however he arguably could be considered one as well... 8-) :idea:

ram pathos...

--The Commish

Commish wrote: ↑February 26th, 2021, 7:50 pm

NN1Badboy wrote: ↑February 26th, 2021, 1:11 pm
I’ve been doing a lot of thinking about this and i’ve been a Rams fan for over 40 years. During that time, I have watched a lot of garbage QB’s come and go. I know there were guys like Jawarski, and Namath on the roster, but they were nothing more than old veteran backups at that point.

"Old veteran backup" Ron Jaworski was 25 years old (1-0 in playoff starts at QB) when the Rams released him in 1976, effectively replacing him with undersized rookie Pat Haden.

That was arguably a major mistake by our team, since the guy turned out to be one of the NFL's top QBs in the late '70s and early '80s.

I'd like to watch Matthew Stafford take a few regular-season snaps from center for the Good Guys, before deciding that he's currently better than Vince Ferragamo, Jim Everett, Marc Bulger and Jared Goff were at their peaks for the Rams.

"The proof of the pudding..." ;)

ram pathos...

--The Commish

Yes, we let Jaws go and he was very successful with Philly and the WTF team, I think... no it was Philly, Dolphins and Chiefs...

But yes, we drafted him...

zackn wrote: ↑March 2nd, 2021, 8:04 am

Ncromwell21 wrote: ↑March 2nd, 2021, 7:37 am that he never won a playoff game is a result of never having a shut down defense or a running game to eat clock at end of game.

Can't overgeneralize. In 2014 they had a defense ranked 2nd in yards and 3rd in points. That's a shut down defense. They went 11-5 that year, their best year with Stafford. It's true they did not have a running game.

Even with that record they had to play a Wild Card game. Stafford was pretty good going 29-42 for 323 and a touchdown. And then there's this;

This call against Cowboys linebacker Anthony Hitchens halfway through the fourth quarter appeared to be textbook defensive pass interference on tight end Brandon Pettigrew. The penalty was called at first, but the flag was then picked up without any explanation, and the Lions faced fourth-and-1 from the Dallas 46-yard line. While the Lions were figuring out whether to go for it or not, they were busted for delay of game, and they had to punt from their own 46. (A 10 yard punt BTW)

The review shows that Hitchens clearly interfered with Pettigrew's right arm, and more importantly, Hitchens didn't turn his head -- he wasn't playing the ball, and that's a textbook violation of the league's rules regarding legal coverage.

NJRamfan1 wrote: ↑March 3rd, 2021, 7:02 am

zackn wrote: ↑March 2nd, 2021, 8:04 am Can't overgeneralize. In 2014 they had a defense ranked 2nd in yards and 3rd in points. That's a shut down defense. They went 11-5 that year, their best year with Stafford. It's true they did not have a running game.

Even with that record they had to play a Wild Card game. Stafford was pretty good going 29-42 for 323 and a touchdown. And then there's this;

This call against Cowboys linebacker Anthony Hitchens halfway through the fourth quarter appeared to be textbook defensive pass interference on tight end Brandon Pettigrew. The penalty was called at first, but the flag was then picked up without any explanation, and the Lions faced fourth-and-1 from the Dallas 46-yard line. While the Lions were figuring out whether to go for it or not, they were busted for delay of game, and they had to punt from their own 46. (A 10 yard punt BTW)

The review shows that Hitchens clearly interfered with Pettigrew's right arm, and more importantly, Hitchens didn't turn his head -- he wasn't playing the ball, and that's a textbook violation of the league's rules regarding legal coverage.

Regardless what came before, they had a chance to take the lead in the end with more than 2 minutes left, and their own penalties killed it.

Here's the thing. In spite of a view that seems to circulate, no, good qbs are not necessarily finished products in their 5th or 6th years. In 2014, Stafford was 25th in completion percentage, 21st in qb rating, 19th in YPA, and 25th in TD%. Stafford grew from those experiences--he just never again had a defense of that caliber to sustain the team. (Though they also did not have a running game in 2014--Bush got hurt, and his replacement, Joique Bell, ended up with 860 yards on 223 carries for a 3.9 average YPC.)

Stafford's big advantage now is his years of experience. He wasn't "the guy" yet in 2014--and that's even with being a pro bowl selection that year. In fact if you measure bad games by having a qb rating of under 70, he had 4 bad games in 2014, and in those 4 games had 6 INTs, a lost fumble, and no TDs. Sometimes, regardless of the talent, qbs take a while to become "the guy." In contrast in that wildcard game, Romo was an 11 year vet who outplayed Stafford in spite of being sacked 6 times (in that game Romo had a qb rating of 114.0).
.

SoCalRam78 wrote: ↑March 4th, 2021, 12:05 pm

Commish wrote: ↑March 2nd, 2021, 10:25 pm Ummmm, what about Bob Waterfield and Norm van Brocklin?

There's no doubt in my mind that they both were franchise QBs for our team.

Roman Gabriel's somewhat borderline, however he arguably could be considered one as well... 8-) :idea:

ram pathos...

Um, okay, modern NFL QB, not a guy playing in the 1940s.

Bob Waterfield: Mid-1940s through early '50s

Norm van Brocklin: Late '40s through late '50s

Roman Gabriel: Early '60s through early '70s

ram pathos...

--The Commish

Rams are being mentioned in trade talks with Detroit for Chase Daniel...
That would be cool...

RGtheFirst wrote: ↑March 8th, 2021, 6:34 am Rams are being mentioned in trade talks with Detroit for Chase Daniel...
That would be cool...

Rams already have a younger and cheaper version of Chase in Wolford.

Cornell29 wrote: ↑March 8th, 2021, 6:48 am

RGtheFirst wrote: ↑March 8th, 2021, 6:34 am Rams are being mentioned in trade talks with Detroit for Chase Daniel...
That would be cool...

Rams already have a younger and cheaper version of Chase in Wolford.

Maybe they’re thinking the three...